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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 10:48 AM Thread Starter
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The Power of Choice

This is SUCH an important video for people to watch. Even though most of the video uses (captive)wild animal subjects, the principles are EXACTLY the same when working with your dog!

http://youtu.be/QQ2MpmxUgSA


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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 01:31 PM
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great stuff Karen, thanks. Trust and respect are much in the same boat and it is imperative to protect our dogs trust. I don't like the words command or obedience when it comes to dog training. Obedience means "submissive to one's will", and command has negative implications as well. These words do not give the animal a choice like this great article talks about. Choice is indeed critical and it builds trust. I think the terms trust and choice are reciprocal. I like this quote from Dr. Roger Abrantes ... "Going hand in hand — or perhaps I should say whip in hand — with the term command is the term obey. Those who do not follow commands are, by implication, disobedient, and therefore deserving of punishment. Commanding is very different from signaling your dog to produce a behavior you desire. In the latter case, if the communication is unsuccessful, it’s not your dog’s fault but yours."

If there's no CHOICE for your dog it becomes a command.

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 03:34 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by davetgabby View Post
great stuff Karen, thanks. Trust and respect are much in the same boat and it is imperative to protect our dogs trust. I don't like the words command or obedience when it comes to dog training. Obedience means "submissive to one's will", and command has negative implications as well. These words do not give the animal a choice like this great article talks about. Choice is indeed critical and it builds trust. I think the terms trust and choice are reciprocal. I like this quote from Dr. Roger Abrantes ... "Going hand in hand — or perhaps I should say whip in hand — with the term command is the term obey. Those who do not follow commands are, by implication, disobedient, and therefore deserving of punishment. Commanding is very different from signaling your dog to produce a behavior you desire. In the latter case, if the communication is unsuccessful, it’s not your dog’s fault but yours."

If there's no CHOICE for your dog it becomes a command.
Unfortunately, we can't get away from the word "obedience" in the performance world, because it is built into the name of the sport. But I agree, I certainly don't like to emphasize it, not do I use the word "command". I like "cue" instead. Again, because in formal, competitive obedience, "signal" means something very specific... a non-verbal cue.

The trainers I work with are both very much of this mindset. They are quick to correct anyone who says their dog "won't" do something. If a dog isn't performing as expected, even on a well established task, It's not that they "won't" but that they CAN'T, under those specific circumstances at that specific time. It's our job to figure out WHY they can't and help them through it.

As our APDT judges always remind us, the DOG didn't make the entry. It's our RESPONSIBILITY FIRST to make sure the dog has fun. (most of the AKC judges are too serious to say something like that )


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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 04:28 PM
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I hear ya Karen, dog trainers and such have and always will struggle with terminology. lol

Dave and Molly
Ian Dunbar was awarded the Outstanding Achievement Award from I.P.D.T.A. Here's a picture of me accepting the award on his behalf.
Member of IAABC ,International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants , Member of Pet Professional Guild
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 04:53 PM Thread Starter
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Here's another video a friend posted today which goes REALLY well with the idea of giving the dog a choice.

http://youtu.be/-cGDYI-s-cQ

Of course, our Havs are a friendly, contact-loving breed IN GENERAL, but not all dHavs love being patted, and probably FEW of them want it all the time. Kodi is VERY clear when he wants more... If he's laying on or against you, and you STOP stroking him, he looks right in your face, with a vey hurt expression, and starts whining until you begin stroking again!

Hope some other people besides you and me are watching these, Dave... Otherwise I'm preaching to the choir!


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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 05:02 PM
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yep another good video. This really comes into play when doing the recall. Thanks again Karen.

Dave and Molly
Ian Dunbar was awarded the Outstanding Achievement Award from I.P.D.T.A. Here's a picture of me accepting the award on his behalf.
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 05:11 PM
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I'm watching, Karen!

RITA
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 05:20 PM
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I'm watching, Karen!
Good mom Rita , (chin-rub, chin-rub)

Dave and Molly
Ian Dunbar was awarded the Outstanding Achievement Award from I.P.D.T.A. Here's a picture of me accepting the award on his behalf.
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 05:38 PM
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I like the food tray bucket! I can see using something like that on a walk and just keep reaching and treating so much eaiser than going into my pocket
Okay so if you were with a litter of puppy's could you use this petting technique to help pick out a dog that would maybe be more into someone petting and touching? Do you think it starts that young? Maddie always comes back for more . Sometimes Zoe seems to want to be close and touched but not with strangers. Maybe my technique of having a stranger put their hand out and try to pet her isn't a good idea. I usually pick her up and bring her more to the persons level and ask them to let her sniff and then pet. Maybe just a sniff is better.

Maddie at 5mo old
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 01-20-2013, 06:06 PM
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The Power of Choice

Quote:
Originally Posted by krandall View Post
Here's another video a friend posted today which goes REALLY well with the idea of giving the dog a choice.

http://youtu.be/-cGDYI-s-cQ

Of course, our Havs are a friendly, contact-loving breed IN GENERAL, but not all dHavs love being patted, and probably FEW of them want it all the time. Kodi is VERY clear when he wants more... If he's laying on or against you, and you STOP stroking him, he looks right in your face, with a vey hurt expression, and starts whining until you begin stroking again!

Hope some other people besides you and me are watching these, Dave... Otherwise I'm preaching to the choir!
I'm watching, too, and taking it all in for the future. Hopefully this old brain will
co-operate and be able to recall it when the time is right.


Mary (miss you, Bailey-1996-2011 and Tyler-1997-2015)
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