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Diarrhea in two dogs
Old 11-03-2012, 04:35 PM   #1
Diann
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Diarrhea in two dogs

I am befuddled and looking to you, the experts on Havanese, for some answers or suggestions. For the last month, Lucy and Charlie have been having bouts of loose to liquid stools with a lot of mucus. They have been tested for parasites, nothing. The vet put them on ID dog food and within a day or two of eating that only, the poops return to normal. Twice I have tried weaning them off the ID. The first time I tried going back to BB Wilderness puppy food I mixed a half-hand full of kibbles to the ID but within two days the stools were back to soft and mucus. They’ve both been on antibiotics (at the same time straight ID) and things were normal. This last week I tried to reintroduce a different type of kibble (Innova) VERY slowly (few kibbles at a time). Again, slimy and soft poo.

Both dogs have the same father. Lucy’s 16 months old and Charlie just turned a year. I’ve been told between 12 months and 2 years dogs start developing food allergies. Is that true? Would it seem strange that they’d both develop the same allergy at the same time? Why is the ID tolerable when it’s so disgusting? What should I try? Why would it be both dogs if it’s not a virus or something else? Neither have shown any other signs—no temp, not lethargic; play the same as always, etc. I have heard their tummy’s gurgling at times.

Thank you for your suggestions!
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Old 11-03-2012, 06:16 PM   #2
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Allergies are not the only reason for a dog to have loose stools, a diet that is too rich can cause it, stress can cause loose stools. ID is often used for dogs with pancreatitis, there are two forms acute and chronic. An acute case if caught early may be mild or in a severe case cause slimy smelly soft stools and vomiting. Too much fat in the diet, stress, and sometimes it is hereditary. These are just a few of the "many" different things that can cause loose stools.

It does not hurt to try another high quility food, first give them at least a week of firm stools before slowing changing from the food your Vet gave you. Try a few kibbles in the food at first a week or two on special food is not going to hurt your pups.

How long did your Vet recomend you keep them on the special food? They may need to be on it for a bit longer so their tummys can heal...it is not a great food for long term...it is an excellent tool for hardening the stools and letting the tummy rest.

I know it is really hard when our pups are sick and two have two with loose stools at the same time, must be frustrating. Sometimes we need to take things slowly.
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Old 11-04-2012, 06:13 AM   #3
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Pancreatitis? I've thought about that, but haven't been able to rationalize why both dogs would start having it at the same time. I also don't know what is in this magic ID stuff to so quickly get their stools back on track. When I look at the ingredents it's horrible stuff! Is there something in this ID that hardens the stools, slows down the digestive process?

The vet did say to make sure they've both had firm, slime-less stools for at least a week before starting to transition to another food. What type of kibble for sensitive stomachs do Hav owners use and have had good success with?
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Old 11-04-2012, 06:26 AM   #4
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I just noticed on Science Diet's website they recommend 1 1/4 can of ID per day for a 10 lb. dog. Our vet said to feed them 1/2 can a day (split into two times a day they've been getting a 1/4 can each feeding time). Any thoughts on how much to feed them of this stuff?
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Old 11-04-2012, 06:58 AM   #5
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Tyler went through a similar situation with his stools last year after losing his brother, Bailey. I thought it was stress related as they had been together for 14 years. In fact, neither of them had ever lived without another dog. After him having to go out several times during the night, I took him to the vet. All tests were negative and she put him on a course of Flagel, gave him a low residue rx dog food and added Tylan to that regimen. Other than the Flagel, she wanted him on this indefinitely. I finally, after months, tried him on Natural Balance LID Sweet Potato and Fish Formula for small breeds. He absolutely loved it, still does and it straightened out his stools immediately. It also cured his bad breath problem. They also make treats in the same formula so he gets those too. Good luck in your quest to find the right formula for Lucy and Charlie. It's a tough thing to figure out.
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Old 11-04-2012, 10:11 AM   #6
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I feed natural balance sweet potato and chicken. My dogs love it, and rarely have diarrhea.
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Old 11-04-2012, 11:47 AM   #7
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The first most important thing you need to do is get your dogs stools firm for at least a week, then go slow, if you want to change to another food introduce it very slowly. As for how much, often the recommended amout on the package is too much. If your dogs do have pancreatitis you need to make for sure that they are fully recovered before starting regular food, chronic pancreatitis can develop from small bouts that scar the pancreas over time causing a chronic form. This is a very serious illiness even when they have a mild attack. In the old days they use to fast a dog for a day or two, now days they know this puts strain back on the pancreas too soon, so they us the special food.

The way that pancreatitis is diagnosed is by the level of amylase and lypase these are elevated...but other things can also cause an elevation. Another test is a snap cPL this can comfirm pancreatitis right in the Vet's office, not all Vet's will have it, you find Vet's that have it, often have a waiting room of over weight dogs...my Vet has one and many people here think Bacon is a great treat. High Fat and too rich foods can bring on a bout of pancretitis. Surgical as well as emotional stress, too much vitamin E, there are host of things that can cause it. As well as hereditatary can make them more susceptible

The ID is not magic (although it works like it), dogs stomachs are not like ours, they do not mash up food after it goes in, enzymes do most of the work and there is a very short transit time as they do not have our intestinal tract. The ID is full of carbohydrates that come out the way they went in, this causes them to come out in a bulk form, for now you want this.

Havanese is one of the breeds that is susceptible to pancreatitis, this is not the end of the world and need not be a problem, as long as you are care full and feed a moderate fat diet, often it's a switch to a food with a bit less protein or where the protein source is from some other animal, also watch dehydrated treats like pure liver (it is a great treat but you can give too much), watch hot dogs, cold cuts, etc. Children are great for sneaking these things to their little pals as are guests, and even family members.

Sometime when our Vets say it could be related to diet or food we think Allergy...but that may not be what they mean, yes the food is affecting them, but their system can not tolerate it, this is very different then a true food allergy. An intolarence is different and can have different levels. Think lactose intolerence some who have it can eat a bit of cheese or ice cream and have mild gas, but others are in the bathroom for hours. Regardless the food is a problem.

I hope this helps you understand pancreatitis as well as other stomach problems that may cause your pups to need a rest. I know many will recommend diet's and advice and they all will have pros and cons. For now you need to get your pups stools hard before moving on to those suggestions. All the best.
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Old 11-04-2012, 12:41 PM   #8
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Pancretitus can be diagnosed in the Vets office. Even my country vet does blood work for pancreatitus. Over the years I have had dogs with slimy mucus stool and was told by the vet to give boiled rice and hamburger (lean) until it ad cleared up for a while. I had one that ate it for weeks then back to the regular kibble. You can cook the hamburger or not. Good Luck.
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Old 11-04-2012, 12:58 PM   #9
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I would not assume pancreatitis. This is for a vet or a nutritionist to determine not us.
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Old 11-04-2012, 02:03 PM   #10
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Dave, I never said it was pancreatitis, I gave her suggestions of things that could be wrong, she ask about the Id and I explained how it works. I also explain in a simple form what pancreatitis is and how a "Vet" will diagnose it, and how sometimes they do not have all the equiptment so they often give a treatment based on symptons. Pancreatitis is very common in dogs more often the chronic form as it often has few symptons. I also don't think she is assuming anything, she is worried and curious.

I answered Diann's questions in a responsible way, I even ask how long the Vet recommended to use the Id.

I have great respect for nutritionalist but diagnosing pancreatitis is beyond their scope, they can come up with a great nutritional plain to address the condition, but only a Vet can diagnose pancreatitis.

My point was to answer her questions and stress how important it is to get the stools firm and rest their tummys before returning them to a normal diet.
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