How much protein for Havs? - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 01:54 PM Thread Starter
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How much protein for Havs?

I"d like to know if there is some consensus as to what percentage of protein is recommended for small breeds like the Havanese. I am trying to choose between Nature's Variety Instinct and Prairie foods, and I like the fact that Instinct is grain-free, but it is quite high in protein. I feed the raw medallions with the kibble.

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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 02:06 PM
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I would like to know that too!
The only kibble Pixie will eat is Wilderness, which is also grain free. She'll only eat the meat portion and pick out the fruit/veg pellets. That and the chicken, beef or turkey I'll cook for her once a day is ALL she will eat. She will not touch fruits/veg of any kind.

I love Mojo's coloring-very pretty!

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 07:53 PM
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They are carnivores so I wouldn't worry so much about to much protein rather too many carbs. JMO. Both my girls are grain free for a over a year now & ever since the switch they are thriving.
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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 07:55 PM
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I have been feeding raw now for quite a while and mine are doing fine on 80 meat/10 organ/10 bone so I am sure it is fine. I know some dogs have an adjustment period with their stool to higher protein kibbles.

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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 09:37 PM
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I feed Beanie Core Wellness puppy food right now; I'm sure it has a lot of protein and that's probably fine as she is putting a lot of muscle on and she is a very active and energetic pup. I'm thinking older dogs wouldn't need as much protein as they are less active...
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 11:05 PM Thread Starter
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My plan when I got Mojo was to stick with pretty traditional feeding combining a high quality kibble with a high quality canned, and I'd chosen Halo...but Mojo has never eaten regularly or with any enthusiasm. He's the worst eater I've ever seen, actually. I've realized he won't starve himself, obviously, and he's grown from puppy to adult size just fine, but it's depressing to see him so uninterested in food and throwing out bowl after bowl of perfectly good food.

I finally gave up and bought some of the Nature's Variety after reading posts on this forum, and for the first time, he's excited about eating and finishes every bowl on a regular schedule. So I had already decided to stick with the raw, but I want to use kibble, too, and that was the part of the decision I wasn't sure about. For the moment, I'm using up the Halo kibble and starting to use a sample baggie of Prairie. He likes the Prairie kibble by itself, too.

I know that giant breeds have to keep low protein or they can develop growth problems, and I know older dogs often are put on very low protein diets, but I've never read anything specific to toy breeds in regard to protein. The whole protein subject seems to be controversial, and almost all vets continue to recommend protein content in the 26% range for all dogs, near as I can tell. This is why I want to hear from others experienced with Havanese on this forum. I appreciate everyone's thoughts.

Pixie's Mom, thanks for the compliment...Mojo appeared to be your typical black and tan at the time we chose him from the litter, and looked very much like his little brother who is still a typical black and tan. Mojo has turned out to have major silvering, I guess, and is coloring more like a sable all the time. He has no real black anywhere anymore, and the dark that is still there is more of a brown. Most of that will be gone if we ever cut his coat.

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Last edited by Mojo's Mom; 02-19-2010 at 11:07 PM. Reason: Added a sentence for clarity
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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-19-2010, 11:30 PM
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here's an article on protein, also check out the home page of that site re. Recall for Natures' Variety. http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=protein

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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-20-2010, 08:51 AM
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I'm so glad this thread was started- I love getting questions answered!

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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-20-2010, 09:44 AM
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I am not an expert by any means and have nothing to back this up scientifically other than my own experience with my boys. I think the amount of protein is not as important as the quality of protein and the other stuff that it is mixed with and how it is processed. Personally my boys did not do well at all on high protein kibbles which still have simple carbs in them usually in the form of potato. Also, so many of the kibbles have astronomical amounts of protein and fat sometimes as high as 38/28 ratio. So the dogs don't get to eat very much of it and are always hungry. I fought feeding raw for a very long time. But I admit my boys have never been healthier and more satisfied. I found it interesting to compare the stats of the Natures Variety Raw Chicken to a high protein kibble or even regular kibble. The percentage of protein of the raw is actually quite low in comparison. I took these from the NV web site for convenience but if I remember correctly they are similar to most grain free kibbles and balanced kibbles. Does anyone know why the Raw's percentage is actually lower? is it all that moisture?

Quote:
NATURES VARIETY RAW CHICKEN

Guaranteed Analysis

Calories
65 per oz

Crude Protein (min): 13.0%
Crude Fat (min): 6.0%
Crude Fiber (max): 2.0%
Moisture (max): 68.0%

NATURES VARIETY INSTINCT GRAIN FREE KIBBLE

Guaranteed Analysis

Calories
490 per cup

Crude Protein (min): 42.0%
Crude Fat (min): 22.0%
Crude Fiber (max): 3.2%
Moisture (max): 10.0%

NV PRAIRIE KIBBLE
Guaranteed Analysis

Calories
391 per cup

Crude Protein (min): 26.0%
Crude Fat (min): 14.0%
Crude Fiber (max): 3.4%
Moisture (max): 10.0%



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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 02-20-2010, 12:26 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, but the raw has moisture in it which skews the numbers when comparing directly to kibble.

I knew about the recall on Nature's Variety, thank you for reminding everyone, though. I'm currently using the Bison.

Thank you, Dave, for the article that is a very nice summary of the subject. It's never made sense to me that grain would be a large part of a canine diet, and I'm leaning toward using the Instinct, assuming Mr. Fussy likes it. This dog is the least interested in food of any dog I've seen, short of my mutt at age 14 and 15, but I understood that.

One food Mojo really LOVES is the Natural Balance rolls, but I don't like them for anything other than training because of the sugar and smoke flavoring. Besides, I need to keep something in reserve to be extra special for training.

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