Reasonable price for puppy? - Page 3 - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
Ask A Breeder Have questions about a breeder or what a breeder should do? Questions about what to look for in a breeder? This is a great area to ask.

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post #21 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 11:13 AM
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I think you mean Nevada, not Arizona? The article was written by Heather (Cache Havanese, Reno area) who used to be a regular here on HF. Heather and I talked several times via telephone before I eventually acquired Ricky from someone else. Heather had nothing available for me at that time. Heather's dogs are expensive because she imports breeding stock from Europe from time to time to keep her bloodlines pure.

Call Heather, she knows people everywhere, all over the US. She is so dedicated to the Havanese breed (as well as Australian Shepherd breed) that she will spend whatever time to help you find the right dog in your area.

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The article was actually written by Bill Burns of The Kennels at Burns Gardens in Washington state for Havanese Breed Magazine

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post #22 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 12:35 PM
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The article was actually written by Bill Burns of The Kennels at Burns Gardens in Washington state for Havanese Breed Magazine
Actually, I believe that the first link about what to look for in a breeder, listed by Karen, is from Heather of Cache Havanese. The second link, about the cost of raising puppies, is from Bill Burns.
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post #23 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 12:40 PM
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Just to add another regional perspective, in Northern California, the price for reputable breeder is between 2000-2500.

I had to submit a written application, do a phone interview, and then used a prior purchaser from my breeder as a recommendation...and then I think what got me to an in person interview was the fact that the breeder had gone to the same university where my daughter teaches... then the breeder observed our interactions with the puppies and adults before we were "approved." I think it was harder than getting a kid into an elite private school.

But my breeder is wonderful, always available for follow-up and I have gone to local dog show to watch Cassie's cousins compete....
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post #24 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 12:59 PM
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Actually, I believe that the first link about what to look for in a breeder, listed by Karen, is from Heather of Cache Havanese. The second link, about the cost of raising puppies, is from Bill Burns.
Gotcha Hadn't realized another article was posted. FourPaws was referencing the Arizona breeder, which was who posted the article from Bill Burns that I linked to.

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post #25 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 01:16 PM Thread Starter
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Jaw-dropping information, all...Makes me wonder how we lucked out with Little Guy, from our great Delaware breeder (please come out of retirement? Please?). I've spoken with breeders who have no questions for me (which makes me wonder; I'm happy to be scrutinized...shows me the breeder cares about where the puppy is headed) to those who want references, an application, a conversation with our vet, and to make a home visit. That last, by the way, though demanding, was the least expensive of the breeders I've spoken with (one pup died in utero; breeder kept the other...oh well).


I'm aware that one can only control for so much, and then it's just...luck/faith/whatever. Hmmmm.

Lots of anxiety over finding another 12-14 pounds featuring deep brown-eyed gaze, wet nose and a happy tail.
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post #26 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 01:49 PM
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Jaw-dropping information, all...Makes me wonder how we lucked out with Little Guy, from our great Delaware breeder (please come out of retirement? Please?). I've spoken with breeders who have no questions for me (which makes me wonder; I'm happy to be scrutinized...shows me the breeder cares about where the puppy is headed) to those who want references, an application, a conversation with our vet, and to make a home visit. That last, by the way, though demanding, was the least expensive of the breeders I've spoken with (one pup died in utero; breeder kept the other...oh well).


I'm aware that one can only control for so much, and then it's just...luck/faith/whatever. Hmmmm.

Lots of anxiety over finding another 12-14 pounds featuring deep brown-eyed gaze, wet nose and a happy tail.
Just another bit of perspective on the cost of RAISING puppies... A good friend of mine recently had a litter, and I've been lucky to be involved from helping with the whelping on. She bought FOUR bitches before she had one she could breed. One had hip dysplasia... It has never bothered the dog, herself, but obviously the decision was made to spay her. Another came from a line that later turned out to have liver problems and although she never has, the decision was made to spay her without breeding also. The third, imported from Europe at high costs, had mild dysplasia AND cataracts... Again, spayed and placed in a pet home where she's doing great. Her 4th bitch, also imported, passed all her health clearances (but now there are FOUR sets of health clearances paid for, not even counting the sire, who passed everything first time) The sire was shown to his championship... Even more expensive because she needed to use a professional handler, the bitch is pointed, but hasn't finished yet.

Then you have all the repro vet costs... not cheap. 6 Healthy puppies, fortunately, without the need of vet intervention which, of course would have boosted the total more. Next the well-puppy vet needs as they grew, including worming, and very soon, their first shots. TODAY, we took them to the Veterinary hospital at the university for the BAER (hearing) tests. That was $600 right there. These puppies were all sold for $2500 (and she had a waiting list of other people who wanted them also) When all is said and done, I am SURE that my friend didn't even break even financially on this litter, and that doesn't count her endless hours of work, or the cost of all the equipment required to whelp and raise a litter at all.

You might think that it's poor luck (or poor decisions) that she had 3 bitches first that she couldn't use (and in each case bought and raised those dogs until they were at least 2 and ready for their adult X-rays). But this isn't at all uncommon. I know MANY breeders who start with a puppy that they have high hopes for, and the bite goes off, or it doesn't have the conformation it should at maturity, or doesn't pass one of its heart clearances... Those costs are "hidden" costs in every litter that is produced.

Another friend (the breeder of my girl, Panda) had just one litter. Again, had to do all the health clearances on the parents, but had a totally uneventful pregnancy... Except that the bitch was carrying ELEVEN puppies, and labor stalled. The night spent in the ER getting those puppies delivered, and trying to save the lives of the two that didn't make it was very, VERY costly. I don't begrudge good breeders once cent of what they charge.


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post #27 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 01:59 PM
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Oh, one other thought, though... Many excellent breeders will reduce the cost of a puppy slightly if the puppy has a conformation "defect" that will not affect the health of the puppy at all. For instance, I know a breeder who recently placed a puppy whose bite was SLIGHTLY off. A Havanese can have either a "scissor bite" (preferred) or a level bite. This puppy has an EVER SO SLIGHT undershot jaw. Most people wouldn't even notice it, and it won't cause ANY health problems for the dog.

A less reputable breeder might just not say anything, and the owner wouldn't notice until it was pointed out later by a vet. (at which point, the person already loves the dog, and wouldn't think of sending it back over something so minor) This puppy was already promised to a family when the problem showed up. (bites change as puppies grow) The breeder told the family about the issue with the bite, and insisted that they discuss it with their vet. The people still really wanted the puppy, so she was sold for a few hundred less than her original price.

So it's possible that you could "save some money" without compromising on the important qualities in a pet dog, by waiting for something like that to happen. But I don't know how you'd ever orchestrate that. It is possible that a breeder would sell a puppy with very poor pigment or eye color for a little less too. But again, good breeders are MOST concerned about finding excellent homes for their puppies, even ones with a little "problem". And they are likely to be highly suspicious of someone looking for bargains.
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post #28 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 02:55 PM
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Just another bit of perspective on the cost of RAISING puppies...
Karen, I found this very interesting. Thanks for sharing.

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post #29 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 04:23 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks, KRandall, for all this. Eye-opening. Just can't tell from interviews w breeders so far about the correlation between quality of care and subsequent price...but will bear all this in mind as I proceed...
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post #30 of 49 (permalink) Old 01-14-2017, 04:57 PM
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Thanks, KRandall, for all this. Eye-opening. Just can't tell from interviews w breeders so far about the correlation between quality of care and subsequent price...but will bear all this in mind as I proceed...
One thing that helps is actually VISITING the breeder. I wouldn't purchase a puppy from people who weren't comfortable letting me see how the puppies are being raised. Most top breeders really WANT you to visit because THEY want to see how YOU interact with the dogs, yourself, and they are proud of showing off what a good job they are doing with their pups.

All three of mine plus this litter I've just helped with, have been litter box trained since they were 3 weeks old. (first climbing out of the whelping box) That is a LOT of work, but it is such a HUGE benefit to the new owners. And while most even half way decent breeders raise their Havanese puppies is the house, being raise in an ex-pen in the living room is not enough. An absolutely clean, enriched environment with tons of different surfaces to explore, things to climb on toys to play with, lots of people visiting, etc. is the way good puppies should be raised.

Avoid breeders who tell you you can't visit because it's not safe for the puppies. IMO, they are breeders with something to hide.

Below are two photos of the play areas afforded puppies by my breeder in NC.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2015 04 29 Picking up Pixel (12 of 89).jpg (61.7 KB, 23 views)
File Type: jpg 2012 09 23 Pam & Tom King-57.jpg (73.4 KB, 22 views)


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