Raw and loose stools? - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-05-2009, 11:18 PM Thread Starter
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Raw and loose stools?

I'm feeding Ellie (now 7 months old), 2 oz of NV in the AM, 1/8 cup of Innova Puppy food in the afternoon and then 2 oz of NV in the PM. I vary the varieties of NV so that one day she'll get lamb, another day venison, another day chicken, etc.

When she eats the raw food, she poops right away (like within 5 or so minutes). Her stools, especially after the morning raw, are very soft - hard to pick up without sort of mushing them. They are definitely formed - she has never had "real" diahrrea.

The speed with which she poops after eating is ok because she is paper trained.

But I am wondering whether the looseness of the stools combined with the immediacy of the pooping after eating the raw food suggests that this isn't the right diet or the right combination for her?

I leave at least 4 hours between raw and kibble and at least 5 or 6 hours between kibble and the second raw.

Stool sample has been done and she did have giardia but after a second round of medication, there is no giardia and no other parasites or problems with the stool sample.

Thoughts?

Louise
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-05-2009, 11:59 PM
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Hi Louise,

My dogs poop right after they eat so I think that is OK. You definitely want those poops to firm up like they should.

So some suggestions...

Do you feed a probiotic? You might want to if you can, that will help restore her intestinal bacteria.

I would ditch the dry food until you get her straightened out. So her system is minimally challenged.

I also would NOT very her type of meat right now. Perhaps just do lamb for the moment. This will also allow you to see if it is the type of meat that is causing this issue. I know that some dogs don't do great with chicken.

Also... a point that not all people agree with here on this forum. My dogs do not do well with alfalfa in any amount. They throw it up. NV contains this ingredient. Also, I give a very very dilute amount of Oil of Oregano to help fully clear up any bowel infections or invaders. It worked WONDERS for my big dog who could not firm up his stools despite the clear tests.

HTH,

Meeka
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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 12:32 AM
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all raw, very hard and dry poops

any change in diet causes loose stools pretty much. Changing back and forth hasn't worked well for us. My dogs eat raw only for a while, then I go back to really good kibble simply because it is hard on our budget.

We have heard of a new place that is 30% less locally, so if that is the case...we will be all raw. My dogs have stools that are almost white, and very dry and easy to clean up.

If anyone gives them table scraps, immediate loose stools. Their stools are looser on good kibble than they have ever been after they are on the raw diet for a week or so.

All dogs systems are different though...

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 09:01 AM Thread Starter
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Which brand is a good Probiotic?

The dry food seems to firm up her stools - why would you ditch it? I've been feeding dry food to help clean her teeth. However, the Innova Puppy has lots of grains. What if I switched to Evo Ancestral which has no grains?

When you say don't vary - do you mean go a month or two with only one variety?

If she has a reaction to the alfalfa, I don't see it - she loves the food and seems perfectly happy after eating - just loose stools which don't bother her at all.

Thanks again.

Louise

Last edited by louise; 04-06-2009 at 09:52 AM.
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 12:06 PM
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Not sure where you got that Innova Puppy has lots of grains. It actually doesn't. It's a high quality food. It is a bit richer in vegetables than some of the other puppy foods.

Quote:
Ingredients:
Turkey, chicken, chicken meal, barley, brown rice, rice, chicken fat, herring, flaxseed, natural flavors, apples, tomatoes, carrots, potatoes, pumpkin, potassium chloride, herring oil, sea salt, sunflower oil, cottage cheese, alfalfa sprouts, dried chicory root, direct-fed microbials, lecithin, rosemary extract, vitamins/minerals

Chances are if your parents never had kids...you won't either...
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 12:10 PM
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First thing I would do is just stick to one raw food, ex chicken, and feed that for both meals and get rid of the Innova. It's possible the combination of the two is not mixing well in her stomach. I would do this for a test to see if after about a week, her stools firm up. I would expect it to.

As well, the kibble does nothing to clean the teeth. If anything it would stick to the teeth and hence gum up her teeth (although even that is an exageration). If you want to keep her teeth clean, start brushing now maybe twice a week. Time to start is when you have a puppy so she's used to it as an adult. I brush my guys teeth once a week even though they chew on bones.

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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by louise View Post
Which brand is a good Probiotic?

The dry food seems to firm up her stools - why would you ditch it? I've been feeding dry food to help clean her teeth. However, the Innova Puppy has lots of grains. What if I switched to Evo Ancestral which has no grains?

When you say don't vary - do you mean go a month or two with only one variety?

If she has a reaction to the alfalfa, I don't see it - she loves the food and seems perfectly happy after eating - just loose stools which don't bother her at all.

Thanks again.

Louise
I suggested to stick to just raw because that produces the firmest stools (and I am biased to raw if truth be told )

I think that there are a lot of good probiotics. I get mine at a good natural foods store, the brand is not so important.

Yes, I mean go for a month or so on just one type of meat. That would be more than ok for sure. Unless of course she gets worse on that type of meat then switch to another but stick to the same type. Just to stabilize her system.

I will not comment any further on alfalfa but just to say several dogs I personally know can not eat it and will throw it up. Obviously you know your own dog and will do what is best for her.

I hope it gets better soon. Keep us posted.

Meeka
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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-06-2009, 12:31 PM
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I don't understand why you are feeding her 3x a day at 7 months? She only needs to eat 2x a day. I would also go either kibble or raw, not both, especially if it's obviously not being good for her digestion.


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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-07-2009, 11:03 AM Thread Starter
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I guess there's no good reason for the kibble. Part of it is that she seems really hungry mid afternoon and since I'm around, I see it and I want to be "nice".

About two months ago I transitioned from free feed kibble to just a little bit mid afternoon which she gobbles up. I guess I could stop it and see what happens.

I will also stick to one variety of raw as soon as I run out of the several different ones I have in the freezer which should only take a few weeks.

Louise
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 04-07-2009, 11:07 AM
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Louise, if she really seems hungry in the afternoon and you're home, why not have a quick training session with a little tiny bit of boiled chicken (or some other treat that is easy on the stomach) just to hold her over? That way you're not feeding her a whole meal but at least she'll have something in her stomach if you think she needs it and you can get a training session in as well.


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