TWO DIFF BREEDS? - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 04:24 PM Thread Starter
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TWO DIFF BREEDS?

It was suggested to start a different thread about this subject than to keep it where it was as it did not fit the title....let me see if I can start this with references to the other thread...

http://www.havaneseforum.com/showthread.php?t=1000

My question is this...who is this Board of Directors and who is Doc and Diane??

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post #2 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 05:20 PM
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Diane Klumb wrote(literally) the book 'the Havanese' & Joanne Baldwin DVM(doc) wrote the medical part. She(they) are considered experts in the area of Havanese. Diane evaluated both my dogs this weekend, by my breeders request. They really are trying (in my opinion) to better the breed by having a Havana Silk variety(Cuban health & standards). You would really have to hear Diane give a lecture on the subject and explain.I could not do her justice.

She stated that they tried to work within the HCA but i think there were a lot of internal issues. They were also very high up on the board at HCA but have resigned so there are no conflict of interests.
Believe me, they know they are not popular with certain breeders etc. but they dont care. They really just want whats best for the breed. I have not noticed any ulterior motives. Anyone correct me please, if i am wrong. The website really explains a lot.
http://havanasilkdog.net/home.html

Tripp, Jax, & Dreamer

Last edited by LuvMyHavanese; 06-12-2007 at 05:25 PM.
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post #3 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 05:37 PM
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I read the Havana Silk Dog Association article.

So, were all these Az and Costa Rica and Russian dogs all originally Cuban? Is the problem, aside from a standard that kept changing, that these dogs are suspected of not being real original Cuban havanese after all? I assume they were all interbred because there was such a small group of dogs to begin with and they were all believed to be the same breed. I understand the idea of working backward to trace health problems and then trying to eliminate them for the good of the breed, but this dispute over which dogs are actually really the real havana silk dogs isn't going to help the AKC havanese. A good, clear standard that clearly specifies the healthy type would. As would judges that would follow the standard.
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post #4 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 05:47 PM
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Same post, different thread: My novice interpretation of what I heard was that they have tried to work within the Havanese club, with the new registry all dogs will have to be at least 2 years old to qualify and have all the health certification and meet the original cuban standard. I heard nothing that would make me think Diane and Doc would be the deciding factor as to who gets in. After seeing the Havanese at the hospitality area and in the ring I was say something needs to be done to tighten the standard as to looks. I understand "good breeders' are trying to get the health issue under control, but for some reason it seems not to be working, for the breed as a whole. One thing I did notice was they all have the great Havanese personallity.
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post #5 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 05:55 PM Thread Starter
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Obviously this is confusing to most people - I can tell you how extremely different my boys look - I believe Austin would qualify as silky as his dad is one of Dianes dogs...Ollie is much smaller - curlier hair - smaller in weight but taller in size - and an absolute DOLL! But people can not believe they are the same breed - however Ollie is in a puppy cut...

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post #6 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 06:00 PM
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Texas A&M study

Those of us who have Havanese for our beloved pets and not to breed have no problem if our dogs don't posess the Arizona kindred and their 133 separate genes which are predominant when those dogs are bred to dogs who do not carry those genes. The problem is those 133 genes are the genes which carry the diseases which are devistating in our breed.
The breeders who are breeding dogs who carry these genes are the ones who are the losers in this bad situation. This link was not found until we were into the 21st century.
I was drawn into this interest because, I have figgured out that Annabelle is at least 75% pure Cuban linage. I am not sure about the other 25% because I need to study the other kennel dogs in her genetics.
Knowing what I have learned now, I would only buy a dog of the Havanese Silk Dog breeding.
The American Havanese is so intermixed with the Arizona kindred that it cannot be bred to true standard.
I am sure there are breeders who can study genes and probably are and can work out our problems. It's the breeders who have to develope the appropriate standard and breed to that standard. My understanding is that the standard is not the original standard and has changed to go along with what is being bred?
I find this a most interesting subject to watch as it developes.
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post #7 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 06:04 PM
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Thats right Ruthann, Plus they know they cant do this with ALL Havs but they are just looking to PRESERVE a small group.

Tripp, Jax, & Dreamer
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post #8 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 06:11 PM
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So the standard should be addressed within HCA. Perhaps it was difficult because some people have made a lot of enemies. There seems to be two groups, the pro Doc/Diane people and the against Doc/Diane people for various reasons, and they often fight. Im not saying Im either, I just wish it could be resolved within our breed/HCA and not divided. Its kind of sad since we should always be doing whats best for the dogs and not what is best for us.
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post #9 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 06:24 PM
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I am not 'pro' anyone but after seeing their presentation & hearing what they had to say, it made sense to me & i appreciate their passion for Havs.
Melissa, maybe try & email them to get a better understanding of what happened. That might explain it better.

Tripp, Jax, & Dreamer
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post #10 of 1429 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 07:09 PM
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OK....so how would a buyer know if they were getting the Havana Silk or Arizona?

Can we confuse people any more about this breed!!! Geez!!!

Obviously from that website I'd rather have the 'havana silk' if it meant lower maintenance grooming, better health and not larger sized....but it does sound a little 'fishy'....

do you think they're just trying to wipe out the pretty chocolates?

it's all so crazy....

I'm about to run to the shelter and just get a mutt!!


Trish
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