At the point of crying - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 07:11 AM Thread Starter
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At the point of crying

Has anyone else been through this and come out the other end. Rollo is 9 and a half months now and I have been doing positive training with him for a long time. He is completely out of control, and no amount of training/treats seem to work. I have been told, by trainer, that if he starts to pull (which he does like a steam train) when we go for a walk, to just stop until the lead slackens - hold a treat next to my leg and get his attention "look Rollo". Ha - I may as well tell him to fly to the moon. He is a nightmare on walks and will almost choke himself to death if he sees another dog, pulling to such an extent that he is up on two legs. (Yes, I have a whole crate of different harnesses which are labelled 'no pull'). I daren't take him off the lead. I do training with him 3-4 times a day with this clicker and it works indoors, outside it literally all goes out of the window.

I got him when he was 14 weeks old and did wonder about his socialisation, but being my first dog was not aware of how crucial this was. I thought he was house reared as that was where we saw him in a pen, but later learned that he was in fact kennel reared. He is completely hyper most of the time - have only just got him to sleep through the night in a crate.

Sorry for the rant, but I am feeling utterly exhausted by him to the point of crying when I come back from a walk, he never stops or sleeps during the day. He has only ever been left on his own twice when I had to take husband to hospital (he has been/is very ill). I think what I want is some reassurance that one day it will all end and he will be an obedient and lovely companion.

Thanks again for the opportunity to rant.

Val
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 09:37 AM
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Get someone to help you that can quickly teach any dog to walk on a leash. It's too hard to describe in words, and expect the person reading to be able to do it.
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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 09:50 AM Thread Starter
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I have a private trainer come to the house now as Rollo was too distracted by other dogs in his training class. We have had two sessions, which comprised of 'look', 'sit'(which he could already do) 'touch' to make him come to your hand, and lie which he still cannot do - he did for the trainer but when I try he just looks confused and wanders around. We aren't even looking at getting him outside until the end of February - sigh.

Positives are that he is a very happy bouncy boy, no aggression whatsoever - unless he sees a fox in the garden which sends him wild. However, he has the concentration span of a gnat. I am beginning to think he had brain cells bred out of him. Some of the problem is that he isn't very food orientated. A few treats fine - and I use very high quality treats, chicken, lamb, beef, dried ox liver, cheese, but he gets bored with them really quickly. He only nibbles at food and has never really been interested, which makes training that bit harder.

Sorry, but always feel a bit desperate when I come back from walking him

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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 12:06 PM
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He's still a puppy. Worse, he is an adolescent puppy. Unfortunately, dog training (and dog-learning) isn't linear. He will be able to do what he is able to do when he's ready. If you've got good, reliable training help, just take a deep breath and stay with the program. Fo now, work on your loose leash walking in a quiet, not over-stimulating situation. Go for your street walks without him. It' really bad for him not only from a training perspective but in terms of his health, to be pulling on his neck like that.

Some dogs a "food oriented" from birth. Others need to be taught that the food is a reward over time, with consistent training. But in a case like you are describing, he's so overstimulated that he can't even respond to the treat as a lure, let alone recognize it as a reward. If the behaviors you want are not rock solid in a quiet, non-stimulating environment (which COULD be in the bathroom with you!!! LOL!) you don't have a prayer of having him respond appropriately on the street. Then, when you KNOW he knows the behaviors in a quiet setting, start SLOWLY generalizing, a small step at a time. That might be that you do it in the kitchen next, then every room in the house, then in various rooms in the house with another person present, then in the back yard alone, then with a person present...

We have a saying at our training school. If things aren't going well, ask your self, "Are you going to far or too fast? Are you asking too much, too soon?" ...shortened to TFTFTMTS. If the dog doesn't do what you want, they usually CAN'T do what you want under those conditions at that time. And it's up to you to back it up until to reach the point where they CAN, then go forward more slowly.
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 01:51 PM Thread Starter
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I now use a car harness when walking him, only thing that won't choke, unfortunately it allows him to pull to the extent that he is scrabbling on the ground or even up on his two hind legs when he sees another dog. Oh well, I will keep on keeping on. He is being neutered tomorrow so at least one day of calm. He has been humping legs a lot lately, and while I try to distract him it doesn't always work - I am not sure though whether it is hormonal or just excitement and the way he expresses it.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 01:53 PM
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Shama heels perfectly at obedience class, but she still pulls on the rare occasion that I take her for a walk. She gets her exercise running free in the fenced-in back yard and in the house and at agility class. I keep meaning to work more at loose leash walking outside in public, but it hasn't happened yet. I think Tom had good advice for you. I would suggest continuing to take classes with Rollo as long as you can afford it and also watch training videos like kikopup.

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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 02:02 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you for the video I sort of try to do this, but have always thought he needs his long walk to tire him out - we go 3-4 miles a day. We have a big garden that he can run around and which we play in so perhaps I will do little bits of walking in the garden and round the house and forget our outings for a while. I will concentrate on trying to tire him out mentally instead.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Val View Post
Thank you for the video I sort of try to do this, but have always thought he needs his long walk to tire him out - we go 3-4 miles a day. We have a big garden that he can run around and which we play in so perhaps I will do little bits of walking in the garden and round the house and forget our outings for a while. I will concentrate on trying to tire him out mentally instead.
A lot of this is over-excitement and lack of attention is just plain being a "teenager". It will get better.
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 02:33 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you all so much for the encouragement and help. I love him to bits, he is so cute, but is wearing me out at the moment. To know that it will get better really helps.

Thank you

Val
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 01-21-2018, 04:29 PM
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Have you try a halter style lead? It worked wonders on my dad's mini schnauzer. He doesn't like having it on, and would rub his face with his arm periodically, but it cut his pulling down almost immediately. It is extremely hard for a dog to pull when his nose is getting turned backward. I tried gender harness, the chest restrictive kind and didn't have luck with that.

I had problem with Zelda pulling until she was over a year old. Not that she pulls super hard (no pulling on 2 legs or scrapping of ground), but hard enough to bother me. Training with treats doesn't work at all with her, because she's so focus on walking/pulling/everything else to even bother to be interested in a treat.

The training that worked for me was turning around whenever she's not paying attention and pull forward. I pop the leash real quick (not yanking her around, more like a reminder of "Hey I am here" of pop and let go). If they actually follow on a turn not needing a reminder then praise praise praise. All I did was go back and forth changing direction erratically for a while, and it doesn't take long for them to realize they need to pay attention to where this crazy human is going. But it actually worked. And yes it even worked with my dad's mini schnauzer which does that pull on 2 legs and scraping walk.

Link (May 2015) & Zelda (Feb 2014)

Last edited by abi38; 01-21-2018 at 04:38 PM.
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