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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 06:55 AM Thread Starter
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New problems with New puppy

I've only had my new puppy for 9 days but some problems have come up. The first 2 nights we had her (breeder had her before that) she was in a small crate without a pee pad. This was done upon the recommendation of the breeder who was following this procedure herself. This was meant to teach my pup to hold it overnight. During the day, the breeder trained my pup on pee pads. During the day we have my pup in a nice sized pen with pee pads. All was going well and Her stools were firm and She used her pads. However, after the first 2 nights She started to poop in her overnight crate. she has been waking us every night at 2-3 AM since with poop on herself and the crate. We thought that dogs do not like to poop where they sleep so we are puzzled by this. The stools are part hard and part soft. We do not understand why her overnight pattern suddenly changed. During the day she uses her pad. We had a stool sample tested by the Vet. No parasites. She is eating the same food that the breeder fed her and nothing new. I started to consult with a trainer. The trainer said to put my pup in a larger overnight pen with a pee pad since We are doing indoor potty training. We will try that tonight. Is that the right approach? Now we are confused because the breeder and trainer differ in their recommendations. Does anyone have insights into this problem? Thanks.
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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 11:51 AM
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If the crate you are using is too large for her it may be why she is pooping in there. It should only be large enough for her to stand up and turn around. After she is consistently keeping her crate clean overnight you can gradually increase the size. Otherwise, I think the pen with a pee pad in it is a good idea too.



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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 12:31 PM Thread Starter
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The pen was only large enough for my puppy to lie down and stand up and turn around. I had a divider in there. Why does she poop in this small space?
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 12:42 PM
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I would never encourage a puppy to eliminate in their crate. Isn't this the same trainer who was against indoor training to start with? I don't think they understand the concept at all.

If she has been taught to keep her crate and bedding clean by the breeder, and it sounds like she has, these incidents are accidents. Plain and simple. Clean them up, clean her up, and go on with life. I hope her crate is close enough to you that you can hear her if she needs to get up during the night. Sometimes they physically CANNOT wait until morning. Just like people. Then you MUST take her out.

If that is not an option, the other possibility is to set her up with an OPEN crate inside an expen, with a pee pad in the expen, so she can leave her crate independently, use her pee pad if she needs to, then return to her clean bed. Kodi, my older one had this arrangement when he was a puppy, because my husband, at that point, didn't want a dog in the bedroom. Since then he caved. Now all three of them are in the bedroom, and one actually sleeps in the bed with us! LOL!

Below is a photo of Kodi's "bedroom" showing the crate attached to one end of his expen, with his litter box on the other end. You can also put a smaller crate inside the expen when they are younger, but beware, many will quickly learn they can climb onto the crate and escape the expen!
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 12:53 PM Thread Starter
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This is not the same trainer that did not want to do indoor potty training. This is another trainer.

My puppy did not cry until AFTER she pooped in the crate. we did not know that she had to poop otherwise we would have taken her to her pee pad which is in her pen in a different room. Her crate for overnight is right next to my bed.

I am not sure if I have enough space to leave her crate open in a pen in my bedroom. space is tight.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 01:42 PM Thread Starter
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I just checked and there is room for leaving the overnight crate with the door open in the pen with a pee pad. I will try that tonight. But can you explain why that is better than leaving my pup in the pen with the pee pad without the overnight crate? I do not really see much of a difference.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 03:36 PM
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I just checked and there is room for leaving the overnight crate with the door open in the pen with a pee pad. I will try that tonight. But can you explain why that is better than leaving my pup in the pen with the pee pad without the overnight crate? I do not really see much of a difference.
Many puppies sleep better in the cozy “den like” feel of the crate. Notice how Karen has blankets over the crate in the picture to give that effect.



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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 08:00 PM
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I know a lot of people have said their puppies slept through the night right from the beginning, especially people with big dogs, but mine did not. It was absolutely developmental - he went immediately and he went back to sleep right afterwards. It only lasted a couple of weeks, and actually those instances were helpful to me in the big picture of potty training because he always went right away, which is something I could praise.

Later came a completely separate behavior when our puppy could hold it all night (but was still young enough that he was waking up early in the morning). After his early potty time he wanted to stay awake and play. We weren’t ready to wake up yet and wanted to go back to bed! That could be what your trainer is trying to prevent/address. There are a few ways to manage that, but to me a puppy wanting to play at the wrong time is a separate issue from a puppy who just can’t hold it yet.

For the first few weeks our puppy woke up in the night all of the time, but it quickly decreased. It didn’t stop completely for a while though. I’m a light sleeper so I could hear him getting restless and knew he needed to go, and I took him outside or to the potty tray downstairs. I do think your puppy is trying to tell you what’s going on, she’s just vocalizing it after the fact. if she’s going potty in her crate at 2am, personally I would set an alarm for 1am and take her potty, just for a short time. You’ll know when she can go longer, and it will be soon. Don’t engage with her too much, and put her right back in her crate afterwards. I think preventing an accident in the crate is the most important thing. It sounds to me like she’s getting it - she’s not just laying in her poop, she’s asking for help.

I do think adjusting the crate with the expen is a good idea, too, especially if she’s figuring out the pee pads during the day. The goal is to prevent an accident in the sleeping area, whether you take her potty or she goes on the pad in the ex pen. If it’s developmental it won’t be long until she can hold it all night, so the ex pen in your bedroom doesnt necessarily have to be permanent. It’s just a matter of preventing accidents in the meantime.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 09:07 PM
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No parasites. She is eating the same food that the breeder fed her and nothing new.
With regard to stool changes, are you feeding the same amount of food on the same schedule? Have you added any new treats she did not have before? Water also can be different. Some are on well water. Others on city water. Some filter and some do not. For a small puppy, wondering if different water could have some impact.

As far as letting you know when she has an emergency in the night, my dogs are in crates in our bedroom and Mia is very clear if she has to go out. However, my yorkie does not make a peep!!! He just gets restless in his crate which eventually wakes me up. I am not sure if there are other dogs like him. I wish he would be more vocal about it. He was very easily potty trained and has never had an accident in the house since he was 10 weeks old. I am wondering if he is just trying really hard to hold it. I should have taught indoor potty training but never even knew such a thing existed. These are my first dogs and as a newbie there are many things I could have done better.
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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 09-22-2019, 09:09 PM
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Karen, I cannot help asking this question...which dog gets to sleep in your bed...or do you rotate dogs?
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