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Best indoor potty

10K views 93 replies 12 participants last post by  Advisor Dog 
#1 ·
So, Oliver did okay with the little trays. NEVER got poop right, though. But this was kept in the pen; those accidents didn't often occur on the floor. Thank god. I'm considering that real grass patch. It's expensive, but is it worth it? I've also heard of people making their own with a patch of sod. We didn't get the indoor training down with him, and it's actually been okay, even in bad weather, but certainly not ideal. Are litter boxes maybe better than those trays? He'd sleep on them.
 
#2 ·
I did not do indoor potty training so cannot comment on that. However, Mia was trained on pee WAY before poop! I was feeding kibble at first which I thought was high quality (Orijens) however while on this diet she would poop up to 9 times per day! I switched her to raw and the poop size and frequency went down to once or twice per day. This made it much easier to train her on poop! I do not think Mia can even get a whiff of sweet potatoes or peas without having to poop!
 
#4 ·
I think people assume that potty box training is going to be automatic, especially if it is started by the breeder. It's not. Even that takes work.

I don't think it really matters all that much which surface you use, though the real grass ones ARE frightfully expensive. I only know one person who has stayed with that, and she's got a lot of money. (the fake grass ones ALWAYS end up stinking... don't even try them)

For us, the best option has been litter boxes with a grid over the litter. But if that weren't an option, I'd probably just use litter. I really hate the smell of pee pads, even if they've been peed on once. So I'd end up changing them so often it would make me crazy, in terms of work cost AND the environment.
 
#7 ·
I assume this is directed at me. I feed my dogs a raw homemade diet mainly. I occasionally feed some of the raw whole prey grinds from My Pet Carnivore for added variety. I have also used some raw whole prey grinds from Hare Today in the past but My Pet Carnivore is closer and has pickup locations. Both companies have great products and I highly recommend them. Their meat comes from local farms, they do not use HPP and they do not contain veggies or any synthetic vitamins or preservatives.

If you choose to feed a homemade diet it is important to do it properly so working with a canine nutritionist is recommended. It is not that hard to do if you are so inclined.

My dogs have never turned their noses up at anything in the more than 10 years I have been feeding them this way. They are ages 11 and 12 with no health issues or allergies.

There are likely other good companies out there but these two are the ones I am familiar with. Key things for a raw diet IMO are 1) locally raised meats 2) no HPP 3) no use of dead, diseased or dying animals 4) balanced blend of meat/bone/organs per whole prey model 5) no veggies 6) no preservatives and 7) no added vitamins. They should get their vitamins from the food. You will hear differing opinions on whether or not dogs need veggies. Mine have not had a veggie in 10 years and are super healthy, however I do include raw green tripe in their diet instead. They also get small amounts of egg including the shell.
 
#8 ·
Indoor potty

Hi Melissa, funny, my dog is named Oliver too and I had him using a litter box until recently. I had a job that took me away from home during the day quite a bit so I wanted him to be able to go when I was gone. The drawback to this is of course that my dog couldn't be trusted in other people's homes because he never learned to hold it in or ask to go outside. Anyway, I first started him on pee pads. It was ok when he was a puppy because he just squatted to pee. As he matured he started to become a leg-lifter, which meant he was missing the pad, and he liked to shred the pee pads all over my apartment. Next I got the largest size pee pad holder I could find (large frame that holds them down). This was better, but I wanted to try the grass patch thingees. I had them delivered weekly which was a little costly, and by the time I threw them out they were disgusting. He was also leg lifting and missing the grass. Next up I wanted to get him going in a litter box, so I went to the Container Store and got one of those large rectangular plastic storage boxes you use to store things under your bed. It was better, but he was lazy and sometimes he would just stand in it with his front legs and start peeing all over the floor. I figured if I elevated the box he would have to jump up all the way into the box. I was correct, but he would still lift his leg and pee against the side of my dishwasher (box in kitchen obviously). Continuing...I took his crate that I had never used and put the plastic box in there, with plastic lids from other storage boxes all around the box against the sides of the gating. This way he could leg lift and pee against the sides, as he was going to do, and it worked! I found over time that the large pellets that are actually for cat litter boxes were the best. I could scoop out peed on litter and poop and it never smelled up my place. This system worked almost flawlessly for five years with only an occasional miss. He would just go in the box anytime day or night and I never had to think about it. Then about six months ago he just stopped using the box. Nothing changed at all about the setup, he just stopped using it and started peeing and pooping on the floor. I have no clue what happened, and like I said he had been using it perfectly for FIVE YEARS! No matter what I did to encourage him he wouldn't use the box. If I put him in there he would just look at me like he was traumatized and then lie down on the litter. Next morning, there was pee all over the floor again. Never could figure it out, but now we're in a house and as long as I stay mindful of taking him out often, he's been good. I also started crating him at night to teach him to hold it till morning. Sometime in the future I am going to have a pet door installed, but for now with the endless quarantine I'm able to keep a pretty good routine going.
 
#9 ·
Hi Melissa, funny, my dog is named Oliver too and I had him using a litter box until recently. I had a job that took me away from home during the day quite a bit so I wanted him to be able to go when I was gone. The drawback to this is of course that my dog couldn't be trusted in other people's homes because he never learned to hold it in or ask to go outside. Anyway, I first started him on pee pads. It was ok when he was a puppy because he just squatted to pee. As he matured he started to become a leg-lifter, which meant he was missing the pad, and he liked to shred the pee pads all over my apartment. Next I got the largest size pee pad holder I could find (large frame that holds them down). This was better, but I wanted to try the grass patch thingees. I had them delivered weekly which was a little costly, and by the time I threw them out they were disgusting. He was also leg lifting and missing the grass. Next up I wanted to get him going in a litter box, so I went to the Container Store and got one of those large rectangular plastic storage boxes you use to store things under your bed. It was better, but he was lazy and sometimes he would just stand in it with his front legs and start peeing all over the floor. I figured if I elevated the box he would have to jump up all the way into the box. I was correct, but he would still lift his leg and pee against the side of my dishwasher (box in kitchen obviously). Continuing...I took his crate that I had never used and put the plastic box in there, with plastic lids from other storage boxes all around the box against the sides of the gating. This way he could leg lift and pee against the sides, as he was going to do, and it worked! I found over time that the large pellets that are actually for cat litter boxes were the best. I could scoop out peed on litter and poop and it never smelled up my place. This system worked almost flawlessly for five years with only an occasional miss. He would just go in the box anytime day or night and I never had to think about it. Then about six months ago he just stopped using the box. Nothing changed at all about the setup, he just stopped using it and started peeing and pooping on the floor. I have no clue what happened, and like I said he had been using it perfectly for FIVE YEARS! No matter what I did to encourage him he wouldn't use the box. If I put him in there he would just look at me like he was traumatized and then lie down on the litter. Next morning, there was pee all over the floor again. Never could figure it out, but now we're in a house and as long as I stay mindful of taking him out often, he's been good. I also started crating him at night to teach him to hold it till morning. Sometime in the future I am going to have a pet door installed, but for now with the endless quarantine I'm able to keep a pretty good routine going.
The only animals I have had that use litter boxes are cats. Although my cats always faithfully used their litter boxes I know people with cats where after years the cat starts going elsewhere. In one case, the owner found that the scent of the litter had changed and this must have turned off the cat. In the other case, someone had told her that as the cat gets older the paws are more sensitive and the cat sometimes prefers a softer litter. Not sure if this applies to dogs but thought I would share.
 
#12 ·
How old is Oliver?

I've TRIED them ALL (or just about) and could go into business reselling potty trays, gates and ex-pens.

Why do you want Grass Sod? I've done that, too. The worst thing I tried was Astro-Turf. Talk about smell, it was Gagging Awful. Dogs who are indoor housebroken to a potty tray, eventually prefer going outside. You don't have to train them to go outside.

If you are wanting to indoor house break Oliver, you have to decide to do it and Stick With A Plan. And, you're in the right place to learn how to do it and you will be successful. BUT .... it takes time and patience. I'm assuming Oliver is a very young puppy.

The KEY is confinement when you don't have EYES on Oliver. He's needs an ex-pen with a potty tray or two, in one room where he is confined while In Training.

Few puppies will pee and poop where they sleep, eat and play. I had to add two potty trays in my ex-pen because initially it was too large for a tiny puppy. It didn't take Patti long before she got the idea where to go. Every time she peed or pooped on the tray, we had a Party :party: with a Treat!

Puppies will have accidents. They'll make a good guess on what to do but sometimes their head is over the tray and their butt's over the floor. This happens once in a while but they get better at aiming as they get older. And...they'll take a nap on it but this will pass.

One tray I did not try was the one with three sides with a grate on top. I think, in particular this would be the thing I would do if I had, had a male dog. But, it's good for females because it has sides that helps keep them in the tray.

I use the Equine Horse Pellets. There's no smell. And, they work under every tray I've used.

I put the photos of my ex-pen set up under another thread that I think you are monitoring.
 
#30 ·
One tray I did not try was the one with three sides with a grate on top. I think, in particular this would be the thing I would do if I had, had a male dog. But, it's good for females because it has sides that helps keep them in the tray.
I do have one. Mine is very careful about peeing and generally I prefer the trays to be as flat as possible so I can slide them out of the way. However, the taller sides are really useful on a potty tray that's on carpet, or if the tray needs to be up against a wall. I used it on the carpet at the top of the stairs where mine was having accidents first thing in the morning. He couldn't hold it all the way downstairs, and the tray solved the problem.
 
#13 ·
Kona is 10wks and have been using Fresh Patch (Real Grass) and success is beyond my expectations. We havent had an accident in 3 days, at night he sleeps in his playpen cries anywhere around 12:30-2:30 without turning on lights (so as no playtime) I open the gate he runs to the grass does his business and back to bed. In the morning its #2 within 15min of waking and goes to the grass. Since I live in a high rise indoor training is a blessing. As far as smell, no urine smell and as long as #2 is picked up right away (and flushed) no smell.`
 

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#20 · (Edited)
And I do have a yard. I'm sure it was my fault, but when he would pee all over the expen, and toddle off the tray without going, I gave up and let him use the yard. Aiming to try something different this time
How old is Oliver? Age makes a difference.

I experimented with everything. You'll figure it out but it sounds like Oliver's ex-pen is too large. He shouldn't have enough room to pee on the ex-pen floor.

I was an Exhausted Puppy Mom for the first 10-months and initially went back and forth on indoor house breaking, which was a new idea. I had a hard time getting my head around the idea of a dog peeing and pooping in the house. I finally stuck with the indoor housebreaking plan because it was easier.

I'll, also, clarify.

I had heard dogs prefer to do their jobs outside and was surprised! once Patti had the freedom to go outside that she would hurry back inside the house to pee and poop.

WHAT?! As she matured that changed.

Now she does her job outdoors 98% of the time. For whatever unknown reason, there are times she's uses the potty tray, probably she's just too lazy to go outside. Mostly it's due to bad weather or lack of access.

TAKING A DOG TO SOMEONE'S HOME: When I take Patti to someone's home I keep her on a leash, which is seldom. I would NOT turn her loose unless it was a very familiar and frequent place we visit.

If people bring their dogs to my house they are required to keep them on a leash or next to them. I don't want dogs running loose in my house and wouldn't turn mine loose in someone else's home.
 
#21 ·
My Oliver? He’s 18 months and completely potty trained outdoors. I’m not going to go backwards with him. I’m trying to figure out what to do with the new puppy. She’s not even here yet. So we’ll see. She’s going to be 8 weeks when she comes home. I totally expect it to be hard! Lol
 
#22 ·
My Oliver? He's 18 months and completely potty trained outdoors. I'm not going to go backwards with him. I'm trying to figure out what to do with the new puppy. She's not even here yet. So we'll see. She's going to be 8 weeks when she comes home. I totally expect it to be hard! Lol
Big Difference!! I'm sure it's possible with a good trainer but 18-months is too old for indoor housebreaking. The little guy has established his routine. Good Boy!

But, Indoor housing breaking an 8-week-old is amazingly SIMPLE, or it was for me. They naturally go to a potty tray but it does take confinement. An ex-pen and limitation to a smallish room area, so they can learn where the potty tray is and get to it.

It was a WHOLE lot easier than outdoor housebreaking, which is why I gave up on that. The baby can learn to do both, but if you do indoor housebreaking stay Laser Focused on doing it.

I only have one dog. Karen has three and can help with training a puppy with an older dog.

Here was my ex-pen. Initially, I had two potty trays to limit the area. Wasn't long before I removed the second one. It ex-pen door opened up to a family-kitchen, the second entrance was closed off with a gate. They GROW!! so fast. I'm sure you have everything for the second baby.
 

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#23 ·
The litter box in the pen part (and then expanding their "safe" area inside the house) is no different no matter how many dogs you have. The "learning to potty outdoors" part is dead easy if you have older, well-trained dogs... you just let the puppy follow along and do what the "big dogs do".
 
#26 ·
Also I’m TOTALLY fine with Oliver continuing to go outdoors. My goal is to get him to use the backyard rather than leashing him up to go out front. But the good thing is that even if we walk and he DOESN’T go, he’s trained and will come whine at me to take him back out vs pooping on the floor. But he never really learned to go to the door, because I always took him out on the leash every few hours. And morning and evening. At least he whines rather than nipping at me now. Which could be interpreted as his wanting to play.

I’m just really hoping to do indoor with Roxie, especially if I can get her to go on the tray or grass or whatever in the middle of the night! Oliver did sleep through the night within a few days of being home. This is the blessing of getting a puppy at 3 months old!
 
#29 ·
But the good thing is that even if we walk and he DOESN'T go, he's trained and will come whine at me to take him back out vs pooping on the floor. But he never really learned to go to the door, because I always took him out on the leash every few hours. And morning and evening. At least he whines rather than nipping at me now. Which could be interpreted as his wanting to play.
I kind of think it will be good for him to be on a good schedule when you bring the new puppy home anyway. It does sounds like he'll eventually give you clear cues, and he's headed in that direction. I don't think there's an age limit on a dog figuring out how to give cues, they just get in when they get it. I was lucky mine did give cues pretty early, but I remember being warned that some don't ever do it, so I was relieved. Mine gave cues for poop really early but pee took a lot longer and it was harder to read.
 
#44 · (Edited)
UPDATE on this.

Tried grass for a week, wish she did fine with, but then she had that parasite thing and I had to be REALLY REALLY sterile. So we tossed that and started using potty trays with litter and they work equally well. I am SO PROUD of her. She is doing so well with potty training for her age.

Also, they are FAR cheaper!
 
#46 ·
Potty Training

Ok folks you are scaring me just a little about how hard it was/is to potty train your pups. I have owned several dogs and have never used the indoor method before. I am planning to crate train and take Desi outside to do his business. Since I live in Florida we don't have to worry about cold, snowy weather however we do have lots of rain at times. My boxer would look at me as if I was crazy if I opened the door for her to go out and it was raining. Anyone else here use the outdoor only method?
 
#52 ·
Ok folks you are scaring me just a little about how hard it was/is to potty train your pups. I have owned several dogs and have never used the indoor method before. I am planning to crate train and take Desi outside to do his business. Since I live in Florida we don't have to worry about cold, snowy weather however we do have lots of rain at times. My boxer would look at me as if I was crazy if I opened the door for her to go out and it was raining. Anyone else here use the outdoor only method?
It is ALWAYS easier to house train a small breed puppy using an indoor potty method, at least at first. Can you ONLY do outdoors? Of course! But it's a lot more work and you are likely yo have more accidents. They are small animals with very small bladders. And while I do NOT consider potty training Havanese to be difficult, it DOES take longer than with most large breed dogs.

Whether you KEEP an indoor potty long-term or not, is up to you. EVERY SINGLE ONE of them eventually learns to potty outdoors, if given access to the outdoors. Every one _I_ know of has clearly preferred outdoors as they get older. It's up to you if you want to continue reinforcing the indoor potty so that they will continue to use it in bad weather.

I _can_ tell you that I've heard from MANY people over the years on this forum who regret keeping up their dog's indoor potty skills/interest when something unforeseen happens. ...Like when my husband had a heart attack out of state, and Kodi and Pixel (a puppy at the time) had to be left alone for 12 hours a day, while I drove long distances to be with him each day. I couldn't arrange for dog care on short notice, but they did FINE with a litter box, toys and a water bottle. I couldn't have done that if they didn't understand litter boxes. But BOTH _MUCH_ prefer pottying outdoors if given the opportunity.

I liken it to our use of a porta-potty. None of us WANTS to use one, but when there is nothing else available, it is FAR better than the alternative! That is the attitude I see in my dogs about the litter boxes. They would rather go outside, but when there is a foot of snow on the deck or it is driving rain outside, I open the door, let them see, and the "humph" at me and go use the litter box instead! LOL! And you DON'T have to worry about your larger dog. My son's two large dogs just left (with them) after they all lived with us for a year. Robbie was a bit concerned that his 70 lb Treewalker might try to use the litter box. Never even crossed his mind! LOL! Fortunately, (or unfortunately, depending on your goals) it is almost impossible to train/retrain an adult dog to a litter box, once they are convinced that dogs "only" potty outside.
 
#47 ·
We started with a training tray in her 2x6-foot ex pen along with her crate, food, and water. When we realized she was no longer using the training tray (as she preferred to go outside on the grass), we removed the training tray. I suspect if we had some sort of emergency and left her with the tray in the pen, she'd figure out to use the tray. All that to say, it's nice for them to know how to use a tray so that if outdoors is not an option for some reason, they know what to do indoors. Karen will tell you that the pads that go under the plastic grid of the training tray are bad for the environment (true) and smell bad (probably true if you have a bigger dog or leave them there a long time), but we were happy with and the pads that went in it. (This tray would go nicely with Desi's nose - tee hee!). Karen or someone else can tell you about the pellet option. As far as the rain goes, Shama often pees on the rocks under the deck if it's raining, but she sometimes just wants to go in the grass even if it's raining. I am pretty sure she would never willingly go out into the pouring rain; we have to carry her down to the yard if it's raining. We accompany her outside 95% of the time anyway ... Good luck!
 
#48 · (Edited)
Here are pictures of Shama's ex pen set-up. Substitute the training tray for the fluffy bed at the end opposite the crate, and you have her initial set-up. When DH and I are teaching at our schools instead of from home, Shama is in her pen all day except for when her dog walker visits around noon. The dog walker is patient and not in a hurry, so she opens the door of the pen and lets Shama emerge when she feels like it. Sometimes Shama doesn't get up until 1:30 PM even though we left her at 6 AM! (The dog walker and Shama hang out in the back yard and in the house; they don't actually take walks ...)
(And she still lies in that alley at age five.)
 
#49 ·
Oh lots of people have just done outdoor. I don’t think potty training is hard, I think a lot of people (myself included) underestimate the length of time it takes for small dogs to become completely reliable. It can take up to a year, which is why indoor training can be useful. Often people accept the dog not being completely trustworthy at only 5 or 6 months old and assume that’s as good as it gets.

Indoor potty training is useful for a lot of reasons, like weather and travel, but one of the biggest is just that it takes small dogs longer to be able to hold it for longer periods of time, and some can’t ever hold it a full 8 hours. It gives them a way to go potty when someone can’t take them out. But many people are home, or can have someone around to take the puppy out long term, so if indoor training doesn’t appeal to them, they have other options.

Personally, I’m a huge advocate of indoor training, and I wasnt sure at first. It’s not harder than “regular” outdoor potty training, both require the same diligence in supervision, and an indoor trained dog will always be able to go potty outside later. However, indoor potty training has to start very early.
 
#51 · (Edited)
Oh lots of people have just done outdoor. I don't think potty training is hard, I think a lot of people (myself included) underestimate the length of time it takes for small dogs to become completely reliable. It can take up to a year, which is why indoor training can be useful. Often people accept the dog not being completely trustworthy at only 5 or 6 months old and assume that's as good as it gets.

Indoor potty training is useful for a lot of reasons, like weather and travel, but one of the biggest is just that it takes small dogs longer to be able to hold it for longer periods of time, and some can't ever hold it a full 8 hours. It gives them a way to go potty when someone can't take them out. But many people are home, or can have someone around to take the puppy out long term, so if indoor training doesn't appeal to them, they have other options.

Personally, I'm a huge advocate of indoor training, and I wasnt sure at first. It's not harder than "regular" outdoor potty training, both require the same diligence in supervision, and an indoor trained dog will always be able to go potty outside later. However, indoor potty training has to start very early.
Size of the dog doesn't determine how long they can hold their pee-pee. Small dogs pee a Small Amount and have Small Bladders. Large dogs pee Big Amounts and have Big Bladders. They both can hold their pee for 8 or more hours or Not.

YES! Indoor potty training is VERY USEFUL and EASY (EASIER)...if done Right and at a Young Age. It does take longer to housebreak a toy dog than a large breed. Havanese are extremely smart and love to please. They are easier than most Toy Dogs.
 
#53 ·
I should clarify, too, that I really don’t believe indoor potty training is harder. In fact, I agree it makes potty training a lot easier. The hard part is the idea of it. There’s a lot of conflicting information, so it’s hard to see the big picture in some ways and easy to second guess. But that’s also true of potty training in general in some ways. If you want to do it, though, the Havanese Forum is the place to get the information. It is hands down the best resource for accurate information on indoor potty training any breed.
 
#54 ·
So you get some other ideas for set-up (though they are very similar to Shamamama's except for brands) Here is Kodi's pen when he was a puppy, and then the pen we used for Pixel and Panda when they came along. Kodi had more room because his was also where he slept overnight for his first two years. Then Dave relented, and the dogs have slept with us in the bedroom since then! LOL! (two in crates, one on the bed)

Kodi's pen had a simple, open litter box with pine pellets. There are several disadvantages to open litter boxes. Some puppies dig in them, spreading them all over the floor and others will eat some. If they eat one or two, it's not a big deal. If you have one of "those" puppies that is going to fill their tummies with pellets... You definitely need to put a grid over it. (and stepping on them on the floor with bare feet is sort of like stepping on small lego bricks. They HURT!!! So we have found that some of the "grated trays" meant for pee pads (and Shamamama is right, I hate the pads... besides the waste, the smell after even ONE pee is too much for me!!!) have plenty of room under the grate for pellets instead of a pee pad. The one in these photos is a UgoDog, but I'm not sure that company is around anymore. There are PLENTY of other options on Amazon, however.

The third photo is what we call "puppy jail". In this case, Panda had had a UTI, and decided that the discomfort was caused by the litter box, so was refusing to use them. If you have a puppy who is not using the litter box (or potty tray... whatever indoor potty option you choose) no matter what the reason is, reducing the space so there is ONLY room for their bed and the potty leaves no options for mistakes. Panda needed this amount of confinement (only when not being supervised by us OUT of the pen, of course) for less than a week before she realized that the litterbox was NOT making her hurt, and she went back to happily using it.
 

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#58 ·
If you do this, you have to know that your puppy will not potty in his crate... EVER. Because you have to use a fairly large crate... One that he can't jump up onto, or it will just become an escape route!
 
#61 ·
No run of the house. Not trustworthy at all. Oh I am not naive. BUT she hasn't had any accidents. She can hold it fairly long, even if uncomfortable. She is kind of picky about preferring her potty tray. I've only had her use the backyard once or twice while we were playing. This is absolutely NOT to say she won't easily go outside when she's ready. Only that I'm so excited this is working. Oliver was a very different story. The fact she alerts me by barking and whining...I am a proud mama. Oliver still doesn't! He bites you and that took a year. Before that, he was reliable but we had to take him out on the right schedule he was used to.
 
#67 ·
Karen,

If I were you I'd screen shot all these responses your taken so much time to write and copy them into Word. The next time all you'll need to do is Open Up Word. Copy and Paste and do some adjustments to to the person and question.

It takes a long time to write quality answers. And I appreciate you and SO! many others who have done the same for me. My advice is the same for all those Others.
 
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