Laproscopic Spay/Partial Hysterectomy - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-22-2014, 04:07 PM Thread Starter
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Laproscopic Spay/Partial Hysterectomy

Well after searching for a place that performs this in my area, I found one quite close. Problem is, the cost. About $2500.00
Being retired and on a fixed income, this will not be possible, but I feel guilty. My wife thinks I'm putting to much thought into this. I don't know. If we were rolling in dough, I wouldn't give it a 2nd thought. Oh well looks like Ginger will have to suffer through the regular spay surgery, since it will only be about $400.00, although I have found a clinic that does them for about $100.00. Probably vet students supervised by a vet. It's still a ways off. Going to wait till she is at least a year old.


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post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-22-2014, 04:17 PM
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Well after searching for a place that performs this in my area, I found one quite close. Problem is, the cost. About $2500.00
Being retired and on a fixed income, this will not be possible, but I feel guilty. My wife thinks I'm putting to much thought into this. I don't know. If we were rolling in dough, I wouldn't give it a 2nd thought. Oh well looks like Ginger will have to suffer through the regular spay surgery, since it will only be about $400.00, although I have found a clinic that does them for about $100.00. Probably vet students supervised by a vet. It's still a ways off. Going to wait till she is at least a year old.
OMG!!! I know it's more expensive than a traditional spay around here too, but not THAT much more expensive. I'm not sure I could justify that bill either.

Speaking of with… for TAHT price, is there somewhere not TOO far away that you could travel to and have it done? Even if it meant a night or two in a hotel? Sounds like it would STILL be a lot cheaper than that!!!


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post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-22-2014, 04:52 PM
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My 2 cents:

You should NOT feel guilty that laparoscopic ovariohysterectomy is cost prohibitive. I have read research articles about it and LOVH postoperative pain scores are less; however, surgical time and complication rates are greater than with traditional spay. As well, not many vets are trained in laparoscopic surgery or own the expensive equipment required for this type of procedure, which is why the cost is greater for pet owners (assuming you can find a vet to do it in your area). Pretty much, equipment cost and necessity for more than 1 surgeon tends to limit its usefulness in small animal practices.

Please don't hesitate to proceed with a traditional spay for your precious Ginger.

-Jeanne-
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post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-22-2014, 06:30 PM
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My 2 cents:

You should NOT feel guilty that laparoscopic ovariohysterectomy is cost prohibitive. I have read research articles about it and LOVH postoperative pain scores are less; however, surgical time and complication rates are greater than with traditional spay. As well, not many vets are trained in laparoscopic surgery or own the expensive equipment required for this type of procedure, which is why the cost is greater for pet owners (assuming you can find a vet to do it in your area). Pretty much, equipment cost and necessity for more than 1 surgeon tends to limit its usefulness in small animal practices.

Please don't hesitate to proceed with a traditional spay for your precious Ginger.

-Jeanne-
I've done a lot of research into laparoscopic ovariectomy, and you are right, Jeanne, there is a high instance of post surgery complications but based on levels of experience of the surgeon concerned - it is extremely variable and dependent on experience. It's absolutely essential to find a vet who has done a considerable number of these procedures, and that's not easy. I am in the UK, where I believe it is more common than in the States - Europe generally is more keen on this way of doing things, so has more qualified people with more experience, and the cost is less prohibitive. Going the traditional route is what my own vet advocates unless a really experienced surgeon can be found. So go for it, Den & Barb, Ginger will be fine. Keep us posted, and please, please don't feel another moment's guilt!!

Last edited by Lalla; 01-22-2014 at 06:33 PM.
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post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-22-2014, 06:38 PM
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As high as it is $2500 is not a terrible price for a LOVH. I was quoted $2800-3200 for the surgery, including blood panels and meds, by the one facility that can do it in the Seattle area.

You might consider what I'll call a 'hybrid' procedure; an open (non-laparoscopic) spay where the ovaries are left in.

If you're on a fixed income your county may provide spay vouchers. When I bought Rory's license there was a section on the brochure that mentioned that for our county.

I'm trying to locate a surgeon that will do a tubal ligation and it looks like we'll have to travel to Canada for that.

But don't feel guilty; you do what you can do. As Jeanne said there are trade-offs regarding outcomes.
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post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-23-2014, 05:35 AM
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As high as it is $2500 is not a terrible price for a LOVH. I was quoted $2800-3200 for the surgery, including blood panels and meds, by the one facility that can do it in the Seattle area.

You might consider what I'll call a 'hybrid' procedure; an open (non-laparoscopic) spay where the ovaries are left in.

If you're on a fixed income your county may provide spay vouchers. When I bought Rory's license there was a section on the brochure that mentioned that for our county.

I'm trying to locate a surgeon that will do a tubal ligation and it looks like we'll have to travel to Canada for that.

But don't feel guilty; you do what you can do. As Jeanne said there are trade-offs regarding outcomes.
As I understood it, it's the ovaries that are removed, and the uterus is left (in an ovariectomy, rather than a full hysterectomy); this removes all the potential risks of pyometra, mammary cancer and whatever else, and is a much smaller, less invasive operation.
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post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-23-2014, 08:41 AM
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As I understood it, it's the ovaries that are removed, and the uterus is left (in an ovariectomy, rather than a full hysterectomy); this removes all the potential risks of pyometra, mammary cancer and whatever else, and is a much smaller, less invasive operation.
That is more commonly done, but there is at least one vet who is pushing to leave at least some sex hormone producing tissue in the dog. The reason for this is a recent study that showed that neutered Golden Retrievers (particularly those neutered before one year, but the rate is higher even for those neutered at a later age) have a HUGE increase in a number of cancers that are much less curable than mammary or testicular cancers. They also have a much higher incidence of CCL ruptures, and the males have a higher incidence of hip dysplasia.

The problem is, the study ONLY looks at Goldens, and only between the ages of, if I remember correctly, 1-8 years. So we don't know for sure whether this holds true for other breeds, or what the numbers would look like with older dogs included. Still, it is some sobering information...

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dvm.../detail/829255

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dvm.../detail/831269

and another one I haven't read yet...

http://www.doglistener.co.uk/neutering_definitive


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post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-23-2014, 08:48 AM
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[QUOTE=krandall;775945]That is more commonly done, but there is at least one vet who is pushing to leave at least some sex hormone producing tissue in the dog. The reason for this is a recent study that showed that neutered Golden Retrievers (particularly those neutered before one year, but the rate is higher even for those neutered at a later age) have a HUGE increase in a number of cancers that are much less curable than mammary or testicular cancers. They also have a much higher incidence of CCL ruptures, and the males have a higher incidence of hip dysplasia.
The problem is, the study ONLY looks at Goldens, and only between the ages of, if I remember correctly, 1-8 years. So we don't know for sure whether this holds true for other breeds, or what the numbers would look like with older dogs included. Still, it is some sobering information…"]

What bothers me is that vets so often treat this topic as if it is simple, and it is NOT! That's really interesting about the Goldens; different breeds are certainly prone to different problems, obviously, but seem to get lumped together often, in the advice you get from vets. They look at one piece of evidence, such as the mammary cancer stats, but ignore the rest, such as the damage of removing certain hormones before the dog reaches maturity, or the potential for causing other problems down the line. In the end, it seems to me that there is more intelligent discussion on a forum like this than one can have in the veterinary surgery. If you don't do your own research, alongside others who want the best for their dogs too, you are at the mercy of as vague and anecdotal a response from your vet as from any other individual, but with the added complication of vets thinking they know everything and certainly know better than you do.
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post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-23-2014, 09:16 AM
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What bothers me is that vets so often treat this topic as if it is simple, and it is NOT! That's really interesting about the Goldens; different breeds are certainly prone to different problems, obviously, but seem to get lumped together often, in the advice you get from vets. They look at one piece of evidence, such as the mammary cancer stats, but ignore the rest, such as the damage of removing certain hormones before the dog reaches maturity, or the potential for causing other problems down the line. In the end, it seems to me that there is more intelligent discussion on a forum like this than one can have in the veterinary surgery. If you don't do your own research, alongside others who want the best for their dogs too, you are at the mercy of as vague and anecdotal a response from your vet as from any other individual, but with the added complication of vets thinking they know everything and certainly know better than you do.
Actually, that's NOT what I got out of these article. I did not get the feeling they were recommending across the board not neutering, or even LATE neutering. They were saying that it shouldn't be across the board in the other direction EITHER> That, instead, it should be decided, on a case-by-case basis between the veterinarian and the owner, what (if any) is the best procedure AND the best timing for each individual dog.

That's how I take it, anyway. And at this time, (when I don't even HAVE a puppy! ) I THINK what I'd do would be delay neutering until the dog was completely physically mature, and then, in the case of a girl, go for laproscopis ovarectomy only. (which is done regularly and successfully where I live) BUT… I reserve the right to change my mind when said puppy actually arrives!


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post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 01-23-2014, 09:36 AM
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Actually, that's NOT what I got out of these article. I did not get the feeling they were recommending across the board not neutering, or even LATE neutering. They were saying that it shouldn't be across the board in the other direction EITHER> That, instead, it should be decided, on a case-by-case basis between the veterinarian and the owner, what (if any) is the best procedure AND the best timing for each individual dog.

That's how I take it, anyway. And at this time, (when I don't even HAVE a puppy! ) I THINK what I'd do would be delay neutering until the dog was completely physically mature, and then, in the case of a girl, go for laproscopis ovarectomy only. (which is done regularly and successfully where I live) BUT… I reserve the right to change my mind when said puppy actually arrives!
sorry, Karen - I should have made clear that I hadn't read the articles yet - rush rush rush! - this comment was based on previous experience with my own vet, not on anything contained in the articles you'd posted which I shall now read!!

"Said puppy"????? Are we contemplating a puppy, Karen???? And, by the by, your plan is exactly what I am thinking of for Cuba, who is just this last day or so beginning to show signs of her first season onset….my little girl!!

Last edited by Lalla; 01-23-2014 at 09:38 AM.
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