Confinement vs Social Isolation?? - Havanese Forum : Havanese Forums
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post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-29-2019, 03:12 PM Thread Starter
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Confinement vs Social Isolation??

Hi everyone! I am planning on getting a Havanese puppy in the next few months and at the recommendation of many on this forum I was reading through the puppy handbook on dogstardaily. On the whole its incredibly helpful, but I'm confused. I know Havanese are extremely social and always want to be with their "people." How do you balance that with the recommendations to keep them crated when you're home and in their expen when you're out of the house? And if your puppy is crated for potty training purposes, when are you doing all of the socializing and training that he recommends? Similarly, in regards to confining them to small areas of your house, do they get upset that they can see you but not be with you? We also spend a lot of time outdoors in our fenced in yard (we live in Southern California, so its typically nice year-round). How do you balance that with the potty training? I feel like there's something I'm misreading or just not getting...

Thank you in advance for your help!
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post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-29-2019, 08:42 PM
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Honestly, you have to pick and choose what works best for you, your family and the layout of the house you live in. I only used the crate for nighttime sleep until she graduated herself to sleeping on a bed (she started quietly getting on the bed when we returned from an early morning potty trip..I wanted a bit more sleep and as long as she was quiet on the bed, she was allowed to stay rather than return to the crate). Our house layout doesnít work for an expen so her lockup area was and remains a small hall bath near the center of the house with a gate across. it had a potty pad when needed in emergency. She spent much of the day in a small office with me and another potty pad in the hallway right outside the office, enclosed by doors on all sides except my office..potty pad in my direct line of sight. We spent most of first 18 months in a house with many gates, standing ones, solid door ways etc. She is still not allowed to roam by herself because of desire to put everything she can in her mouth. We keep her near us when we are home so never really used her lockup area while home because we gated the house into small enough areas, i.e. kitchen, family room, dining room. I would have done it differently if we had a house with more open floor plan, but our house was built in 1920 with many small rooms and hallways!! Anyway, all this detail to underscore that there are no hard and fast rules. Small areas, close supervision, frequent potty breaks are key but flex in how to do it. Many of us used crates at night but didnít during the day.
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post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-29-2019, 09:48 PM
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Honestly, you have to pick and choose what works best for you, your family and the layout of the house you live in. I only used the crate for nighttime sleep until she graduated herself to sleeping on a bed (she started quietly getting on the bed when we returned from an early morning potty trip..I wanted a bit more sleep and as long as she was quiet on the bed, she was allowed to stay rather than return to the crate). Our house layout doesn’t work for an expen so her lockup area was and remains a small hall bath near the center of the house with a gate across. it had a potty pad when needed in emergency. She spent much of the day in a small office with me and another potty pad in the hallway right outside the office, enclosed by doors on all sides except my office..potty pad in my direct line of sight. We spent most of first 18 months in a house with many gates, standing ones, solid door ways etc. She is still not allowed to roam by herself because of desire to put everything she can in her mouth. We keep her near us when we are home so never really used her lockup area while home because we gated the house into small enough areas, i.e. kitchen, family room, dining room. I would have done it differently if we had a house with more open floor plan, but our house was built in 1920 with many small rooms and hallways!! Anyway, all this detail to underscore that there are no hard and fast rules. Small areas, close supervision, frequent potty breaks are key but flex in how to do it. Many of us used crates at night but didn’t during the day.
I agree. We didn’t do it exactly this way, but none of mine werecrated during the day either, except for in the car orat the training facility. Never at home. They were either in an ex pen right near us or gated close to us with close supervision until they had proven that they were trustworthy.


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post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-30-2019, 11:39 AM
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I think you are misinterpreting a few things. Here is a condensed article from Dogstar https://www.dogstardaily.com/files/Housetraining_1.pdf

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post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-31-2019, 11:20 AM
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We did not use the ex-pen during the day, but were lucky enough to have a completely pad-trained puppy from the breeder. Also lucky to be retired, and could watch the puppy every minute! He was crated at night, watched during the day, and crated whenever we left him, which was rare that first six months. We soon learned where to put his pads, for awhile we had two upstairs and three downstairs in slightly different areas of the family room- he knew exactly where they were and would run to them. We then started cutting back pads, until we only had one... it took awhile, with many trips outside and tons of praise, but he never really had a real "mistake" which would be using the floor with no pad. This whole process took about a year, but we live in Chicago and winter was a little harder. SoCal should go smoother, as you can be outdoors more, so more options for outdoor potty and praise. We also trained him to pee on command, poop is more difficult but he will try, and he definitely knows what we want when we give the command.

(I don't know if other havi owners do this, but we continue to praise every elimination, even though he is completely outdoor housebroken. Whenever he poos or pees, he looks at me as to say "bring it on, tell me I am fabulous".
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post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-31-2019, 11:47 AM
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I never crated him during the day. In fact, we didn't end up crating past the first week. We had an expen set-up in our bedroom and downstairs, where he could be with people, but honestly, he cried there too. We still used the ex-pen (with an indoor potty tray for the time it worked. We ended up outdoor training). When I had my eyes on him at all times he was out of the pen. Once he was reliable enough that I could trust he wouldn't pee if he'd just gone, he had more and more freedom. At 8 months he's only in the pen when he's really hyper and so are my kids (not too often, usually just for 10-15 minutes here and there) and when I am not home. You're right in that they need their people. He ended up sleeping in our bed, which worked because he would NEVER have an accident in my bed. And I could trust he wasn't getting into anything. At eight months he pretty much has run of the house BUT this is because he follows me everywhere. I couldn't trust him not to chew or eat something small or inappropriate otherwise. Despite the fact he's (knock on wood) potty trained. I do think you're misinterpreting some of the advice. You can be out with your dog all day and not need a crate (for socialization). And I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to crate all day. Whatever confinement you use is for when you can't supervise. I would be very cautious to give too much freedom before housebroken reliably, for SURE. I think the confinement in that regard is why we were able to housebreak relatively easily. We didn't have to break the bad habit that he could EVER go in the house. But there's a balance. Playing and going on walks etc are important.
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post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 08-31-2019, 07:08 PM
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(I don't know if other havi owners do this, but we continue to praise every elimination, even though he is completely outdoor housebroken. Whenever he poos or pees, he looks at me as to say "bring it on, tell me I am fabulous".
It’s funny, because if I find a poop on one of the litter boxes and I don’t know who did it, I’ll say, “What good dog went poop on the potty? We have to take this and flush it! The “owner” comes running with a smiling face and a waggy tail, and we parade to the bathroom together for the ceremonial flushing. I don’t know why, but they get a BIG kick out of that! LOL!


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